God Evangelist chosen by God not man.
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Talking about God
Talking, Praying, Intercession. Jesus My Walk. Jesus Your Walk.
About God, Jesus
“Hendrik, you told me you are going to talk about God, but Jesus is God. God is Jesus, so you are talking about the same person.”
“Hope that is well spoken, and I agree that when you see Jesus you see God and when you see God you see his son Jesus Christ.”
“Hendrik, the paradigm all over the Religious world and particular here in Australia, America, England and other places such as Europe is that even though Jesus talks about his Father, Jesus is really talking about himself and when Jesus was killed crucified, God was hanging there as well.”
I wondered what I should say to Hope now, because Hope is right and wrong, so as I thought about the issue of God I decided to say, “I want to share with you some Scripture text and my job is not to interpret what the texts are saying.”
“Not interpret scripture text is denying what the texts are saying.”
“What do you mean?”
“Even at my college I have been trained to read a sentence and then talk about its meaning. And we know that it takes two to work out what is said. So we have the Bible text, no 1 and then we have the other, which can be me or you, no 2. No 2 has to think about the meaning of the text.”
“Well Hope we are on the same page. The Bible the text is the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit talks to your heart as you read.”
“It is simply amazing how I missed the point the Bible I read is the Holy Spirit.”
“No! No! that is not what I mean.”
“Well! What do you mean?”
“The Bible, the texts are Spiritual.”
“I’ve got it, The Bible is Spiritual.”
“Amen! Amen! That is right the Bible is truly Spiritual, that is you are reading a Spiritual book.”
“Right Hendrik, I have the open Bible and looking at John chapter 3 and 16. Am I looking at the Spirit.”
“If that is not the case how can you say the Bible is Spiritual.”
I think I have used the wrong example. he thought, but to fix the problem he said to Hope, “The Bible is just a book with text, the reason we say the Bible is Spiritual is because as you read the Bible the Holy Spirit that lives in you takes the text of the Bible and applies it to your or my heart. It is the Holy Spirit that makes the Bible Spiritual for us. The Bible by itself without the Holy Spirit is just a book. If you like without the Spirit bringing the text to life the Bible is just text, no life.”
“Wow Hendrik! I have never thought about the Bible in this way.”
“I am surprised Hope because how long have you been a Senior Pastor?”
“For something like 20 years and I and a group of two hundred came together with a vision to build the Stadium in Houston.”
“Are you close to Lakewood Church.”
“You bet we are, it was the Lakewood Church that inspired us to do the impossible. I have sent you a photo, you can see it now. We decided land over the Southwest Freeway. so we are a few miles from Lakewood Church.”
Having opened the Email I could see a building and a map. So I thought, surely Hope is not the boss in a Church such as this. So I asked, “If you talk about Lakewood Church what is your church like?” If he has fifty thousand members I wonder?
“I haven’t a Photo in front of me because all photos of the building were wiped last week because an IT Developer came and upgraded our computers etc and I forgot to copy old files so we lost the lot. Even our members list was lost. Imagine the work that is being done now to find lost information.”
“That is tragic Hope.”
“It surely is so the photo you have in front of you now is similar to our Church.”
“What is that tower all about.”
“The tower is for inspiration. At the top you can see a huge area of Houston and in the viewing room there is enough room for two hundred people to sit and often we have meetings and Bible study groups in it.”
“I am impressed. What is the name of your church?”
“Is that it, ‘Inspiration’.”
“I see the other photo you sent, it looks like a huge building.”
“It is more then huge because imagine it holds fifty thousand people.”
“My mind is blown away at the thought.”
“Hendrik we have been talking about the Bible and the Holy Spirit.” Hope wanted to get back to the previous issues.
“So Hope the Holy Spirit is living in us the same way God, Jesus is also living in our hearts.”
“That is why we say God is one made up of God, Jesus, Holy Spirit.” said Hope.”
“That is correct.”
“In our Church we do say Jesus, God, Holy Spirit is one.”
“How about unpacking Jesus, God, Holy Spirit is one.”
“That is not possible.”
“God, Jesus, Holy Spirit is one.”
“I know what you are saying. But pull God, Jesus, Holy Spirit is one apart, pull out God, pull out Jesus, pull out Holy Spirit.”
“That is not possible, God is all there is. We talk about Jesus and we talk about Holy Spirit we are simply talking about God, because all three are God.”
“Hope I do not mean to be discourteous, but if you cannot unpack God, Jesus, Holy Spirit I think your church members may be confused as the roles each person has in the God Head.”
“The way we sort things out we say it is a conundrum, we cannot explain why Jesus can be God. And we say. Just except the concept by Faith and not worry about why.”
It dawned on me that I may also be caught up in what I do not understand about God, Jesus Holy Spirit. So I added. “How about if I use a few examples in the Bible which will help you unpack what we are discussing. Is that ok by you?”
“How about if I sent you the text by Email so you can see it. I can just copy, paste and send.”
“Right it has gone.”
“Ha, here it is Hebrews 1-4 and it says, 1 In many and various ways God spoke of old to our fathers by the prophets; 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by a Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world. 3 He reflects the glory of God and bears the very stamp of his nature, upholding the universe by his word of power. When he had made purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much superior to angels as the name he has obtained is more excellent than theirs.”
“Notice verse 2 God has spoken by a son, notice God talks about a son and it bit later here, he, (the son) reflexes the glory of God and bears the very stamp of his God’s) nature. We are here talking God a person and a son a person, two people. Jesus and God two.”
“Hendrik my leader who supervisors 200 groups has just walked in. I might get him to sit with me while we talk about the texts here. I’ll just change the phone so two of us cane talk in a conference setting.”
“His name is Robert and by coincidence he also has red hair and sharp blue eyes. Often we sit here and talk about Bible interpretation.”
“Robert, I have talked about Hendrik who lives in Deepwater Australia and we are going to talk about a few texts and he has shown me Hebrews 1: 1-4.”
“Fancy that,” Robert looked in surprise at the texts he could see on the monitor. “To me, these couple of texts are dynamite,”
“What do you mean dynamite,” said Hendrik from 15000 kilometers away.
“Well, we teach here at Inspiration that Jesus is God. That meant Jesus is in fact God. But these few texts show that we are looking at two people. God has a son and God’s son is the exact reflection of God.”
“So Robert, you are saying that we are teaching our members that Jesus is God when in fact Jesus and God are two people not one.”
Hendrik thought, I think the second person may be a mistake because Hope sounds a bit on edge.
“That is right.” said Robert quietly with caution in his tone.
Hoped said carefully, “Robert, do you really believe God and Jesus are two separate people in God’s head and not one.”
“I know we and most other churches teach God Jesus is the same person, but I thought many years ago that that teaching was not right and this text Hendrik gave you tells you.”
Trying to stay in charge of the conversation with Hope and Robert, Hendrik said, “We can see that there are areas we teach things that may be out of line, but that is life and that should not become a stumbling block in the church.”
“You are right Hendrik.” said Hope.
“I am a good example of how to behave,” Robert said in a bright tone. “I believed for years about God and Jesus being one, but are two different identities in the God Head. I have kept quiet because all other people around me believed Jesus is God.”
“Having said that Robert,” added Hendrik. “You will be surprised how many people in Aspiration believe Jesus and God are separate people.”
“When I think back I can see why some people have questioned that text because it does say. God had a son and the son is a reflection of God.”
“Hope let’s leave these texts in Hebrews alone and let us look at others I am sure we will find other differences.”
There are many different houses and lots of people with a lot of different views. That is life and we need to reach for our Goals in spite of differences.
Hendrik did not see Robert whispering to Hope, “What Church does Hendrik belong to? Ask him.”
“Hendrik I never asked you whose Church you belong to. Aspiration follow the Baptist Teaching even though we are independent and are not joined to the Baptist Union.”
“Once again we have a coincidence here because my parents were Baptist and I am a Baptist and now I am independent and I am not joined to the Baptist Union.”
“This is eerie, coincidence with us is amazing. I believe obviously we are destined to meet,” said Hope.
Robert said, “That settles it with me as well. I fully support Hope as he interacts with you here in Deepwater and us in Aspiration in Houston.”
“Thanks’ for your encouragement. I believe we are destined to meet and help each other.”
“Hendrik I have a meeting to go to in an hour, how about tomorrow 10 am the same as today we will talk again.”
“Fine, Hendrik did not realize the meeting Hope had to attend was a crisis meeting because Aspiration borrowed twenty five million dollars and there was a cash flow problem in repaying the money.
Hope called Hendrik at 5pm Houston time and said, ” I overlooked the time difference between us and if you say 10 am Australia Eastern Coast then Houston is about 5pm the day before. So it is 5pm now as we speak.”
“It is 10 am here in Glen Innes and I guess we had better pick a time that suits best.”
“How about you have the meet at 9 am your time in Glen Innes and that means for us it will be 4 pm here in Houston.”
“If that suits you, fine.”
“How was your meeting yesterday.”
“It was a disaster. there were two thousand people because we called it a crisis meeting, we have a problem with repaying a loan.”
“How big was the loan?”
“Twenty five million dollars to build the church.”
“Let’s not talk about it because we have another meeting in a few days to ratify the decisions made at yesterdays meeting.”
“The trouble is Hope if your church is having trouble, then as a church, membership could be hurt.”
“I know that.”
“How about if we talk again in a few days after the second meeting and see if the clouds are being lifted.”
“Right I will give you a call, probably next week, see you then.”
More to come
Next time we will talk about God himself, again. and we will also talk about Jesus and God’s relationship. and I am sure you are going to find it interesting. I am sure you will never have heard what I say.
is to be an athlete in the Kingdom of God
and run the race that Jesus has given us to do. Knowledge is a key.
“I’m all ears.”
Next time. Hendrik
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